Yikes thats a bit rich!

[Kurt Friday]

I just used NI's upgrade advisor to check out the cost of upgrading my 8.2.0 to 8.2.1. I was a bit shocked that its going to cost me $1999 to get a bug fix. That's going to tear a big hole in this weeks beer budget.

I noticed that when you upgrade you are forced to go with a 1 year SSP which is probably the bulk of the cost, but hey, I don't want one.

[LAVA 1.0 Content]

CITATION(SciWare @ Apr 12 2007, 02:42 PM)

I just used NI's upgrade advisor to check out the cost of upgrading my 8.2.0 to 8.2.1. I was a bit shocked that its going to cost me $1999 to get a bug fix. That's going to tear a big hole in this weeks beer budget.

I thought the update was free... Is it not ?

Man... does your :beer: budget really reaches $ 2k a week ?? I wonder how many pints of Guinness it represents

[crelf]

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 12 2007, 10:42 PM)

That's going to tear a big hole in this weeks beer budget.

Only if you're a shelia...

[Tomi Maila]

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 12 2007, 03:42 PM)

I just used NI's upgrade advisor to check out the cost of upgrading my 8.2.0 to 8.2.1. I was a bit shocked that its going to cost me $1999 to get a bug fix.

It seems as if NI is double charging for their software. Fist they sell 8.20 with a large number of bugs at least when it comes to LabVOOP. Then they fix a number of these bugs and resell the same value proposition again for the customers who have already bought the same story. Definitely not the right way to go. I hope someone at NI management notices that this is not good PR.

Tomi

[gleichman]

Have you checked with your local sales rep? This is probably just a bug with update advisor. Download the new version and see if your serial number works with it.

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 12 2007, 06:42 AM)

I just used NI's upgrade advisor to check out the cost of upgrading my 8.2.0 to 8.2.1. I was a bit shocked that its going to cost me $1999 to get a bug fix. That's going to tear a big hole in this weeks beer budget.

I noticed that when you upgrade you are forced to go with a 1 year SSP which is probably the bulk of the cost, but hey, I don't want one.

[Kurt Friday]

QUOTE(TiT @ Apr 12 2007, 08:51 PM)

I thought the update was free... Is it not ?

I don't believe it is, if you take a look at this page which discusses upgrading it states that the update is free to SSP members but those who are not will have to purchase the upgrade. If you then go through the upgrade advisor it forces you to upgrade with a SSP for a total cost of $1999

QUOTE(crelf @ Apr 12 2007, 09:29 PM)

Only if you're a shelia...

I'm trying to get in touch with my feminine side. :beer:

QUOTE(gleichman @ Apr 12 2007, 09:40 PM)

Have you checked with your local sales rep? This is probably just a bug with update advisor. Download the new version and see if your serial number works with it.

I'll contact them in the morning, I'll wait till I discuss this with the rep before I download and try my existing serial.

[LAVA 1.0 Content]

CITATION(Tomi Maila @ Apr 12 2007, 03:37 PM)

It seems as if NI is double charging for their software. Fist they sell 8.20 with a large number of bugs at least when it comes to LabVOOP. Then they fix a number of these bugs and resell the same value proposition again for the customers who have already bought the same story. Definitely not the right way to go. I hope someone at NI management notices that this is not good PR.

Tomi

Indeed !

I though we had to pay only when the second digit increases.

e.g. LV 8.0 to 8.0.1 is free

and LV 8.0 to 8.2 is not.

Is that not how it works ?

On m'aurait menti ?!?

[crelf]

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 12 2007, 11:53 PM)

I'm trying to get in touch with my feminine side. :beer:

Enjoying a shandy, are we?

QUOTE

I'll contact them in the morning, I'll wait till I discuss this with the rep before I download and try my existing serial.

Yeah - have a chat with Jeremy - he'll sort it out.

[Kurt Friday]

I just spoke to my rep, the only way for me to upgrade is to purchase a 1 year SSP. Gone are the days when you just payed 800 bux or so to upgrade your version of LV to the latest, and bug fixes were free. The good side is that within the year 8.5 will be out so I'll automaticaly get that.

I'm just a little sore at NI for forcing me to go with this just for a bug fix.

QUOTE(crelf @ Apr 13 2007, 06:37 AM)

Enjoying a shandy, are we?

I need another shandy to sooth my throat which is sore and calloused from swearing.

[Val Brown]

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 12 2007, 05:01 PM)

I just spoke to my rep, the only way for me to upgrade is to purchase a 1 year SSP. Gone are the days when you just payed 800 bux or so to upgrade your version of LV to the latest, and bug fixes were free. The good side is that within the year 8.5 will be out so I'll automaticaly get that.

I'm just a little sore at NI for forcing me to go with this just for a bug fix.

I need another shandy to sooth my throat which is sore and calloused from swearing.

It's not "...just for a bug fix" -- as you've said, you're also getting the next major update, viz to 8.5.

[crelf]

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 13 2007, 10:01 AM)

I need another shandy to sooth my throat which is sore and calloused from swearing.

QUOTE(SciWare @ Apr 13 2007, 10:01 AM)

I just spoke to my rep, the only way for me to upgrade is to purchase a 1 year SSP.

I knew NI were bringing in the SSP on all LabVIEW purchases, but I'd assumed that it wouldn't be until the next major release... It seems a little odd ot me that they would bring it in on a 0.0.x release.

[Jim Kring]

We're rapidly entering a world where software is a service. Better be ready.

[lavezza]

My group switched divisions in our company on January 1st. It looks like one of the things that got screwed up during the transfer was our SSP. It has lapsed. Well, there are bug fixes in 8.2.1 that we really need so I downloaded the installer and installed it. Remember, there is no difference between the evaluation installer and the regular installer now, features activate based on the license.

Basically, as far as NI License Manager is concerned 8.2.1 = 8.2. Which is what we are used to with NI bug fixes. The install went fine (make sure to do the simulation.msi fix if installing over 8.2).

It sounds like your rep is just as confused as the rest of us. You'll need an SSP if you want NI to ship you a CD. But if you have a valid 8.2 license, with or without a valid SSP, you can still get the 8.2.1 bug fixes by running the installer. Now, 8.5 will be another story.

ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe

[Kurt Friday]

QUOTE(lavezza @ Apr 13 2007, 08:54 AM)

My group switched divisions in our company on January 1st. It looks like one of the things that got screwed up during the transfer was our SSP. It has lapsed. Well, there are bug fixes in 8.2.1 that we really need so I downloaded the installer and installed it. Remember, there is no difference between the evaluation installer and the regular installer now, features activate based on the license.

Basically, as far as NI License Manager is concerned 8.2.1 = 8.2. Which is what we are used to with NI bug fixes. The install went fine (make sure to do the simulation.msi fix if installing over 8.2).

It sounds like your rep is just as confused as the rest of us. You'll need an SSP if you want NI to ship you a CD. But if you have a valid 8.2 license, with or without a valid SSP, you can still get the 8.2.1 bug fixes by running the installer. Now, 8.5 will be another story.

ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe''>ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe' target="_blank">ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe

That's great, just what I wanted I'll give that a blast. I'll bite the SSP bullet with 8.5 but if I can hang that off till then at least the 1 year window doesnt start ticking from now.

[crelf]

QUOTE(lavezza @ Apr 13 2007, 10:54 AM)

Basically, as far as NI License Manager is concerned 8.2.1 = 8.2. Which is what we are used to with NI bug fixes. The install went fine

That sounds better

[Val Brown]

QUOTE(lavezza @ Apr 12 2007, 05:54 PM)

My group switched divisions in our company on January 1st. It looks like one of the things that got screwed up during the transfer was our SSP. It has lapsed. Well, there are bug fixes in 8.2.1 that we really need so I downloaded the installer and installed it. Remember, there is no difference between the evaluation installer and the regular installer now, features activate based on the license.

Basically, as far as NI License Manager is concerned 8.2.1 = 8.2. Which is what we are used to with NI bug fixes. The install went fine (make sure to do the simulation.msi fix if installing over 8.2).

It sounds like your rep is just as confused as the rest of us. You'll need an SSP if you want NI to ship you a CD. But if you have a valid 8.2 license, with or without a valid SSP, you can still get the 8.2.1 bug fixes by running the installer. Now, 8.5 will be another story.

ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe''>ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe' target="_blank">ftp://ftp.ni.com/evaluation/labview/pc/labview_821.exe

I found that, not only did I NOT need to run simulator.msi, when I tried to run it, I got an error. Do you have a valid URL from which I can download it? I'm currently traveling and so don't have my installation CDs with me and want to make certain -- if possible -- that my installation is up to date.

[lavezza]

QUOTE(Val Brown @ Apr 12 2007, 08:19 PM)

I found that, not only did I NOT need to run simulator.msi, when I tried to run it, I got an error. Do you have a valid URL from which I can download it? I'm currently traveling and so don't have my installation CDs with me and want to make certain -- if possible -- that my installation is up to date.

First, you only need to run simulation.msi if you installed 8.2.1 over 8.2. If you uninstalled 8.2 first (or never had it installed), you won't need to run simulation.msi. Second, not running simulation.msi won't stop 8.2.1 from running. Only certain functions are affected. See http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/allkb/C4B6EF55C6948A27862572B30068BF91' target="_blank">Installing LabVIEW 8.2.1 On Top of LabVIEW 8.2 Causes Broken VIs and Libraries

I ran simulation.msi from "C:\National Instruments Downloads\LabVIEW\8.2.1\Products\LabVIEW_Simulation_Core_Shared\simulation.msi" which is the directory that gets created when you run LabVIEW_821.exe.

[Val Brown]

QUOTE(lavezza @ Apr 12 2007, 09:08 PM)

First, you only need to run simulation.msi if you installed 8.2.1 over 8.2. If you uninstalled 8.2 first (or never had it installed), you won't need to run simulation.msi. Second, not running simulation.msi won't stop 8.2.1 from running. Only certain functions are affected. See http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/allkb/C4B6EF55C6948A27862572B30068BF91' target="_blank">Installing LabVIEW 8.2.1 On Top of LabVIEW 8.2 Causes Broken VIs and Libraries

I ran simulation.msi from "C:\National Instruments Downloads\LabVIEW\8.2.1\Products\LabVIEW_Simulation_Core_Shared\simulation.msi" which is the directory that gets created when you run LabVIEW_821.exe.

OK. Thanks for the info. I've gone ahead and run simulation.msi.

[TG]

You touched a NERVE JK

I agree about the service thing. Just another corrosive MS influence on NI.

NI does not really give a hoot about its customers when it comes to making more money first. (Thats the MS influence)

Its one thing to be in Business its quite another to have the gall stick it to your own customers again and again.

I have purchased and used NI products for over 12 years (They have a lot of my companies money) and until last year I NEVER had any problems with either the HW or LV.

Now Im not sure I should upgrade or not.

Usually when I call NI to get clarafication I always get a diff story on each call.

But then this is not de place to rant...

sorry bout that.

[Jim Kring]

QUOTE(John Rouse @ Apr 13 2007, 11:03 AM)

You touched a NERVE JK

I agree about the service thing. Just another corrosive MS influence on NI.

NI does not really give a hoot about its customers when it comes to making more money first. (Thats the MS influence)

Its one thing to be in Business its quite another to have the gall stick it to your own customers again and again.

I have purchased and used NI products for over 12 years (They have a lot of my companies money) and until last year I NEVER had any problems with either the HW or LV.

Now Im not sure I should upgrade or not.

Usually when I call NI to get clarafication I always get a diff story on each call.

But then this is not de place to rant...

sorry bout that.

John,

We are entering a world where the definition of "computer", "user", "software", and "operating system" are becoming blurred due to our highly connected, networked world. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtualization' target="_blank">Virtualization makes computers more like software and multi-cores (and multi-processors) makes the definition of "1 computer/user" rather meaningless.

The bottom line is that things are changing very rapidly and software that works today, probably won't work well in few months, without patches and upgrades. Software as a service is really the direction that everything is heading. let me rephrase that, software as a service (sold in various units of value to the customer) will completely replace software as a product. I'm sorry if you don't like that, but you had better get used to it.

[uPDATE] the software service providers that provide the best service to their customers and treat them well will win (I hope).

-Jim

[Val Brown]

QUOTE(Jim Kring @ Apr 13 2007, 11:37 AM)

John,

We are entering a world where the definition of "computer", "user", "software", and "operating system" are becoming blurred due to our highly connected, networked world. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtualization' target="_blank">Virtualization makes computers more like software and multi-cores (and multi-processors) makes the definition of "1 computer/user" rather meaningless.

The bottom line is that things are changing very rapidly and software that works today, probably won't work well in few months, without patches and upgrades. Software as a service is really the direction that everything is heading. let me rephrase that, software as a service (sold in various units of value to the customer) will completely replace software as a product. I'm sorry if you don't like that, but you had better get used to it.

[uPDATE] the software service providers that provide the best service to their customers and treat them well will win (I hope).

-Jim

Jim is right on target about this. SW is definitely transforming into a service and leaving behind almost all of the "trappings" of its having been seen as a product. And there really isn't any way around this -- it's not just a MS "evil empire" disease being spread maliciously, this is the way it is (and actually has been IMO) in the unix, Mac and other OSs. Why do you think we have continuous updating occuring across ALL platforms? Contrast what happens in SW with something like your car. SW undergoes a major update and you download it over the net, perhaps with or without a charge depending on how "major" it is. Let's say through, that the Fuel Injection system on your car is "updated" ("improved") -- you definitely pay for that product as well as for the installation. The idea that, since you bought the car you ought to just "get" the update, is a really interesting one, esp when what we are considering to be the "product" is actually a collection of services (read "properties" and "methods") that allow us to perform services on various HW platforms.

It really is about transitioning the understanding of what software IS...

[crelf]

QUOTE(John Rouse @ Apr 14 2007, 04:03 AM)

NI does not really give a hoot about its customers when it comes to making more money first.

Whoa - that's a bit strong! Sure, they're a company that needs to make money (otherwise they won't be around for very long), but I've seen many many many examples of NI giving a hoot about their customers.

I'm hoping that you wrote your post in an emotive state (as your "raw nerve" comments says). I strongly suggest you do some resaerch to find out why NI has opted for the SSP-only progam before you jump to conclusions like that...

[creynold]

There is a thread on the same subject on one of the NI forums. I thought it would make sense to link to some comments in that thread that address some of your questions about 8.2.1 and NI's policies...see David Gardners posting in that thread.

[Kurt Friday]

Well I'm happy.

I downloaded the eval 8.2.1, installed it and it was happy with my 8.2 serial. So it looks like your 8.2 serial works to activate the 8.2.1 eval irrespective of you having an SSP or not. This still seems to conflict with the info from NI.

[Michael Aivaliotis]

QUOTE(Jim Kring @ Apr 13 2007, 11:37 AM)

the software service providers that provide the best service to their customers and treat them well will win (I hope).

None of the bugs I cared about were fixed in 8.2.1. as indicated from the NI buglist. So NI has dissapointed me with the 8.2.1 release. Am I being selfish? Of course I am... I'm a customer.