JCFC Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 Hi to all I read this in Slashdot: Comparing the Size, Speed, and Dependability of Programming Languages I have a question: Can Labview beat those Programming Languages?, How Labview perform doing that tasks? Quote Link to comment
Aristos Queue Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 A) The thread-ring and chameneos-redux benchmarks would be hard since the rules explicitly call out cooperative multitasking models as "interesting alternate implementations." LV's dataflow implementation is cooperative thread scheduling. B) The rest of the benchmarks seem like they'd be viable to implement, though I have no idea how you'd get a relative measure of "code size". Quote Link to comment
vugie Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (Aristos Queue @ Jun 2 2009, 07:07 AM) ... I have no idea how you'd get a relative measure of "code size". That's very interesting problem I'm thinking about from time to time. Metric used here is byte size of gzipped code with removed comments and reduced whitespaces. I guess that it's somehow proportional to time spent writing the code, but not taking into account time spent on searching in documentation, debugging, etc. For LV it should be similar. For each node and terminal in LV code we may assign the word which lenght should be proportional to its depth within palette tree. Plus one or two characters for each wire, maybe more for longest wires (scrolling is so slooow when wiring), plus some overhead for each subvi, plus 500 characters per each openning of control properties dialog (grrr),plus whitespace between above and that's it. But such a comparison wouldn't show few of many LV strenghts such as time spent on debuging or on creating GUI. Quote Link to comment
Aristos Queue Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 If the goal is "developer time", then we might need to track keystrokes and mouse clicks used to create the VIs, since the other languages are essentially tracking keystrokes. Quote Link to comment
crelf Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (Aristos Queue @ Jun 2 2009, 01:07 AM) B) The rest of the benchmarks seem like they'd be viable to implement, though I have no idea how you'd get a relative measure of "code size". http://forums.lavag.org/Node-count-versus-SLOC-t3632.html' target="_blank">GOBs. Quote Link to comment
John Lokanis Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (vugie @ Jun 2 2009, 01:28 AM) (scrolling is so slooow when wiring) Slightly off topic, but why would you ever make a VI where you needed to scroll to wire? If the VI is so big that two connected nodes cannot fit on your screen, then it is time to re-factor! Back on topic, I think the whole concept is like trying to compare apples to oranges. There is simply no way to accurately compare a graphical language to a text based one. It's like comparing radio to television, IMHO... Quote Link to comment
crelf Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (jlokanis @ Jun 2 2009, 01:35 PM) If the VI is so big that two connected nodes cannot fit on your screen, then it is time to re-factor! ...unless you're working with children of ActiveX nodes or the link - yuck! Quote Link to comment
ShaunR Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (jlokanis @ Jun 2 2009, 06:35 PM) Slightly off topic, but why would you ever make a VI where you needed to scroll to wire? If the VI is so big that two connected nodes cannot fit on your screen, then it is time to re-factor! Like this one QUOTE (JCFC @ Jun 2 2009, 05:36 AM) Hi to all I read this in Slashdot: http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/05/31/1423203' rel='nofollow' target="_blank">Comparing the Size, Speed, and Dependability of Programming Languages I have a question: Can Labview beat those Programming Languages?, How Labview perform doing that tasks? Interesting. Most of the languages I've never heard of and quite a few common ones missing. I would like to have seen Assembly in that mix since its one of the least verbose and fastest, so I guess it would be close to the "ideal". I think the title is a bit misleading though. since really it is a test of the compiler optimization rather than language. Quote Link to comment
asbo Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (ShaunR @ Jun 2 2009, 03:56 PM) Like this one <snip> R.I.P., data flow ... Quote Link to comment
PaulG. Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (ShaunR @ Jun 2 2009, 03:56 PM) ... it is a test of the compiler optimization rather than language. Indeed. That is why assembly isn't much "faster" than C now days. I've heard it said: "C is the new assembly language." Compilers are getting that good. As far as assembly being "one of the least verbose" I will have to disagree. Assembly needs 25 lines of code to turn an LED off and on. Quote Link to comment
ShaunR Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (PaulG. @ Jun 2 2009, 09:28 PM) Indeed. That is why assembly isn't much "faster" than C now days. I've heard it said: "C is the new assembly language." Compilers are getting that good.As far as assembly being "one of the least verbose" I will have to disagree. Assembly needs 25 lines of code to turn an LED off and on. I know what you mean. I guess it depends on what is meant by verbose. add r2, r3, r4 is less verbose than (say) MyEnormouslyLongResultName := MyEnormouslyLongVariableName + MySecondEnormouslyLongVariableName. Thats why pictures are better :beer: + :camera: = Quote Link to comment
hooovahh Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 QUOTE (ShaunR @ Jun 2 2009, 05:08 PM) Thats why pictures are better :beer: + :camera: = I think that expression is up for interpretation on the compiler. Does it mean that if I take a picture of you with beer you will shake your finger at me? Or does it mean I should not take a picture while I am under the influence of beer? Does it imply that pouring beer into a digital camera will cause it to turn into a yellow face shaking his finger? or is that a near by person shaking their finger because I broke their camera by pouring beer into it? Quote Link to comment
Phillip Brooks Posted June 4, 2009 Report Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (ShaunR @ Jun 2 2009, 05:08 PM) I know what you mean. I guess it depends on what is meant by verbose.add r2, r3, r4 is less verbose than (say) MyEnormouslyLongResultName := MyEnormouslyLongVariableName + MySecondEnormouslyLongVariableName. Thats why pictures are better :beer: + :camera: = If MyEnormouslyLongVariableName > YourEnormouslyLongVariableName then iWin == True uWin == False Else uWin == True iWin == False EndIf Quote Link to comment
ShaunR Posted June 4, 2009 Report Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (hooovahh @ Jun 2 2009, 10:46 PM) I think that expression is up for interpretation on the compiler. Does it mean that if I take a picture of you with beer you will shake your finger at me? Or does it mean I should not take a picture while I am under the influence of beer? Does it imply that pouring beer into a digital camera will cause it to turn into a yellow face shaking his finger? or is that a near by person shaking their finger because I broke their camera by pouring beer into it? It means there are too few smiley's on this forum Quote Link to comment
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